We agnostics aa is a secular alcoholics anonymous meeting in kansas city. Mar 27, 2017 a little ditty on the big book of alcoholics anonymous we agnostics. The 164 and more book, ebook, and web site are all concordances which display passages from the big book alcoholics anonymous, the twelve steps and twelve traditions, and the a. In the preceding chapters, you have learned something of alcoholism. How could there possibly be a god when there are so many starving people and wars where everybody says god is on their side.
If, when you honestly want to, you find you cannot quit entirely, or if when drinking, you have little control over the amount you take, you are probably alcoholic. A little ditty on the big book of alcoholics anonymous we. We agnostics is the fourth chapter of alcoholics anonymous, or the fifth if you include the doctors opinion. Overview preface preface chapter 1 bills story chapter 2 there is a solution chapter 3 more about alcoholism chapter 4 we agnostics chapter 5 how it works chapter 6 into action chapter 7 working with others chapter 8 to wives chapter 9 the family afterward chapter 10 to employers chapter 11 a vision for you. May 21, 2008 in its chapter, we agnostics, the big book outlines its attitude toward spiritual and religious matters. Alcoholism12 step support a perspective on we agnostics chapter 4 of the big book colornavyim not going for this god stuff. A perspective on we agnostics chapter 4 of the big book 1. Thoughts on chapter 4 we agnostics what i mostly got from this one is that god is a requirement of the program. May 17, 2018 chapter 4 we agnostics step 2 concluded the wednesday night study group come and join us in person wednesday nights 7. Apr 21, 2019 aa big book ch 4 we agnostics 4th edition thegaa03.
Silkworth aa big book aa anonymity statement anonymity is the spiritual foundation of all our traditions. Big book alcoholics anonymous chapter 4 we agnostics pages 44 57. We agnostics seven deceptive delusions by samuel ross 1 it is possible that the writer of this chapter doesnt understand the tremendous difference between agnostics and atheists but it is more likely that he is simply disregarding the difference in order to manipulate its readers. Step 1 the doctors opinion bills story there is a solution more about alcoholism step 2 we agnostics steps 312 how it works into action working with others. Our meetings are more secular than most, providing a supportive environment for anyone with a desire to stop drinking regardless of their religious or spiritual beliefs, or lack of belief. Chapter 4 we agnostics, atheists, and believers e arly on in our practice of the steps, we members of eda are required to establish a foundation on which we can begin to build a durable and resilient recovery, one that does not leave us vulnerable to triggers or easily blind sided by unexpected mental blank spots. Take all 12 steps in just 4 hours download this aa big book step guide and work book. Aa speakers joe and charlie we agnostics the big book comes alive duration. In doing so, the big book also presents a method by which readers can investigate theological questions for themselves. We cannot subscribe to the belief that this life is a. Original manuscript chaper 4 we agnostics alcoholics anonymous alcohol allergy rehabilitation of alcoholics dr. That means we have written a book which we believe to be spiritual as well as moral.
This is a long chapter, but like the rest of the big book, the ideas are simple and straightforward. Chapter 4 of the big book is titled we agnostics and explores the meaning of a higher power. Most of our members find chapter 4 we agnostics to be particularly condescending and not helpful to their sobriety. Eda big book ch 4 we agnostics, atheists, and believers eating. We are sure god wants us to be happy, joyous and free.
Taken from the book alcoholics anonymous frequently called the big book. By the very act of critiquing chapter 4, we agnostics, i admittedly commit aa heresy. That said, i wanted to share some thoughts on some passages from the chapter to the agnostic from the bb. Provided to youtube by cdbaby we agnostics alcoholics anonymous alcoholics anonymous. May 10, 2018 chapter 4 we agnostics part 3 the wednesday night study group come and join us in person wednesday nights 7. Our origins are the students of the big book group, which has met in woodland hills, california since december of 1985. How can we find the power that will solve our problem. Aa officially recognizes atheist and agnostic membership in this. We agnostics in the preceding chapters you have learned something of alcoholism. Chapter 2, there is a solution, chapter 3,more about alcoholism, and chapter 4,we agnostics.
An illness of this sort and we have come to believe it an illness involves those about us in a way no other human sickness can. Beginning chapter 4, we agnostics page 4 5 paragraph 3 we know how he feels to top of page 46 ending. We hope we have made clear the distinction between the. Basically this is about step 2 of the 12 steps of aa. According to the big book, when we speak of god, what do we mean. Chapter 4 we agnostics part 3 the wednesday night study group come and join us in person wednesday nights 7. We agnostics kansas city is an alcoholics anonymous group in the kansas city area. Indeed the entire chapter seems to focus not on acknowledging that you dont need an interventionist god to get sober, but rather to convince you that you do. We agnostics seven deceptive delusions stinkin thinkin. Some thoughts on the big book and we agnostics i do not consider myself to be a religious person but do have many people in my life i have a huge amount of respect for that are religious. For many of us that seems to be an impossible task. We have a way out on which we can absolutely agree, and upon which we can join in brotherly and harmonious action. I dont have an issue with the prayers although some do.
Oct 12, 2017 one of many good places to begin is in alcoholics anonymous aka the big book, specifically chapter 4, we agnostics. Chapter 4 we agnostics in the preceding chapters you have learned something of alcoholism. Chapter 4 chapter 4 we agnostics in the preceding chapters you have learned something of alcoholism. Step 3 made a decision to turn our lives over to the care of god as we understood him. Play all mix big book chapter 4youtube aa speakers joe and charlie we agnostics the big book comes alive duration. Chapter 4 we agnostics essendon baptist community church 4 8 buckley st, essendon vic 3040. There is a chapter in the aa big book titled we agnostics.
I mean i understood it intellectually, but what i wasnt getting is it god means anything that is outside the self that has the power to healhelpetc. Mar 09, 2012 there is a chapter in the aa big book titled we agnostics. This diagram is a handy reference for where the steps are located in the big book. This is because we agnostics includes terms such as creative intelligence, which would appear not to gel with the notion that we are allowed to accept the greater scientific universe as the higher power of our choosing. Listen to special editions podcasts from the a vision 4 you website. If, when you honestly want to, you find you cannot quit entirely, or if, when drinking, you have little. You can also hear our thursday big book study recordings at 641 7153900, pin 2989.
But by the end of chapter 4, we agnostics, the contradictions are glaring. Willing to believecornerstone of a spiritual structure. I dont have to cringe when others in the rooms refer to the power that is greater than themselves as god. Well, reading and discussing this chapter plus a reading we discussed in the abstinence book in my meeting saturday helped me to find the spiritual aspect of abstinence. Early on in our practice of the steps, we members of. Its not about being sponsoredits about sponsoring others that is a predictor for recovery.
In its chapter, we agnostics, the big book outlines its attitude toward spiritual and religious matters. But because we have the chapter of we agnostics, it insinuates that every who comes through the door of aa or any 12 step program is an agnostic we all are. We agnostics, atheists, and believers 105 from believers and people of faith in eda. Has the book made clear the distinction between the alcoholic and the nonalcoholic.
Sep 18, 2017 when we agnostics fails us as i read the first chapter of the book, what is your suffering. The ideas in this chapter present a very powerful part of the program, and i believe. The we agnostics chapter of the big book just got back from a meeting closed discussion where we read this entire chapter and shared on it holy crap what an arrogant, insulting, and condescending way of looking at atheists and agnostics. One of many good places to begin is in alcoholics anonymous aka the big book, specifically chapter 4, we agnostics. A little ditty on the big book, alcoholics anonymous. Step 4 made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves. We will examine this chapter in detail to see what if anything we atheists. I dont have to define what a power greater than myself is. The purpose of this study guide is to enable the student to better understand the information the authors of the book, alcoholics anonymous, intended to impart to each of us based on their experience and knowledge of alcoholism and. This is the audio version of the fourth edition of the big book, the basic text for alcoholics anonymous.
Session 6 step 2 we agnostics step 2 came to believe that a power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity. If, when you honestly want to, you find you cannot quit entirely, or if when drinking, you have little control. Chapter 4 we agnostics step 2 concluded published by joe b on may 17, 2018 chapter 4 we agnostics step 2 concluded. Chapter 4 we agnostics page 40 for either case, atheist or agnostic, we are going to have to find some way to have this spiritual experience, and to use this power greater than human power. If you are truly alcoholic, what is the only thing that will conquer it for you. Four short years before writing this chapter, the principal author, bill w.
A little ditty on the big book of alcoholics anonymous we agnostics. I think this chapter gets ignored quite often, especially by members that feel theyve got a good grasp of the faith business, but it helped me a great deal when i was trying to wrap my. Intolerance in big book alcoholics anonymous, 12 steps and. Words contained within the first 164 pages of the big book.
Alcoholics anonymous big book video chapter four we agnostics. In the preceding chapters you have learned something of alcoholism. Aa big book story 7the man who mastered fear 4th edition duration. Alcoholics anonymous the the big book, the basic test. Chapter 4 we agnostics i n the precedingchapters you have learned something of alcoholism. Alcoholics anonymous chapter 4 we agnostics in the preceding chapters you have learned something of alcoholism. We agnostics is the fourth chapter of alcoholics anonymous, or the fifth if you. The chapter lays out the intent of the book, which is not to change the 12 steps, but to explain them in nontheistic language. Aa big book ch 4 we agnostics 4th edition thegaa03. A perspective on we agnostics chapter 4 of the big book. In fact there is an entire chapter addressed to the agnostic, chapter 4, we agnostics.
Reading guide for we agnostics amethyst recovery center. The big book would advise you, however, not to be too perturbed by these. The word broken down from greek is, a meaning without, and gnosis meaning knowledge. We cant just leave that part out and try to do the other stuff because it wont work.
We hope we have made clear the distinction between the alcoholic and the nonalcoholic. In essence, the chapter emphasizes that all drunks come into aa as agnostics and godless but, over time, they rid themselves of that ridiculous concept and see the path towards a higher power code speak for the more commonly used word god. Overview preface preface chapter 1 bills story chapter 2 there is a solution chapter 3 more about alcoholism chapter 4 we agnostics chapter 5 how it works chapter 6 into action chapter 7 working with others chapter 8 to wives chapter 9 the family afterward chapter 10 to employers chapter 11 a. Chapter 4, we agnostics, is truly a remarkable piece of writing. When faced with the proposed writings of the eda big book, we who are more religiously inclined could not accept many of its secular precepts without mentioning some of our thoughts on the matter. As my head cleared, i started reading the big book, and since the. The point is that aa, the twelve steps, and the big book itself, are there to help you to find a power greater than yourself, which will help you solve your problem. This is the great news this book carries to those who suffer from alcoholism. Chapter 4 of the big book, we agnostics, in which bill w argues that recovery requires belief in god, is an insulting mishmash. One more time i have come to believe that there is in fact a great reality. The big book would advise you, however, not to be too perturbed by these references.
Our meetings dont include a prayer and for many of us, that makes all the difference. Nov 05, 2015 provided to youtube by cdbaby we agnostics alcoholics anonymous alcoholics anonymous. Hence we have the lords prayer and the senerity prayer read in meetings. During any such meeting to study the aa big book, you would expect to encounter a wide variety of viewpoints on the. The big book bunch 12 step workbook we are the big book bunch group of alcoholics anonymous. We agnostics chapter of the big book religious forums. Ive discovered that a lot of people ignore it, especially people that adhere to a particular religious tradition, and feel that theyve got the idea of faith in a higher power under control. This chapter we agnostics starts with a definition of alcoholism. This is the heart of the big book, the chapter that introduces the twelve steps of alcoholics anonymous, and is so revered that it is read to open most a.
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